Browning Hi Power

Couple years ago I was looking to buy a stock HP and trick it out.  Then I ran across this little guy.  The mag came with the pistol, they say made in Italy, I have no idea where to find mags that have that spring to eject the magazine but they are pretty handy.  My only gripe is I can barely feel the trigger reset. 

 

 

"A pirate is not the sort of a man who generally cares to pay his bills...and after a time the work of endeavoring to collect debts from pirates was given up."

          -Frank R. Stockton

Consigliere posted:

This thread will do for Hi Powers what the revolver and .22 rifle and pistol threads did......cost everyone a boatload of money.  That's why I love this place.

And check out Nighthawk's BHP.  

I know  better than to check out Nighthawk..I'm assuming  they're  on par with some of the other 'smith's  who work on HP's,  which means they're  way outta  my league. So, what's a broke-dick guy like me to do..? Well, I kinda been eyeing a CZ 75, in SAO, which might fill the bill.. Hmmm,I'll  have to think about this...I know it's  not a BHP, but it's  close...You're  right, this will probably end up costing me money....

R.Moran posted:

 

CZ Shadow II

I saw pics of those over at P-F  forum,  They're  supposed cost around $1100, if I could afford that, I'd  go buy a HP.  That's  why I was eyeing  the CZ75,  cost was alot less, and Cajun Gun Works makes some nice stuff for them.  Hmmm, what to do...

R.Moran, thanks, I've been lurking, just haven't had much to say.  My life is pretty mundane right now.  I've been learning some machining and related stuff though, planning on using this Hi Power to further that.

Kaltesherz, I see that spade in your avatar, my last unit before I ETS'd was 1/327.

Gunner posted:

 My only gripe is I can barely feel the trigger reset.

 

 Trigger reset is over rated

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"Good landing, good fight, and good luck" James M. Gavin 09Jul43

 "they say if it works, it's a good tactic...I say anything can work once" 

I know the older FN versions are more collectible, but what is the consensus on the new manufacture ones through Browning? Are they any good? 

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Joined:  1/30/05           Location: Graham, Wa

Gunner posted:

Couple years ago I was looking to buy a stock HP and trick it out.  Then I ran across this little guy.  The mag came with the pistol, they say made in Italy, I have no idea where to find mags that have that spring to eject the magazine but they are pretty handy.  My only gripe is I can barely feel the trigger reset. 

 

 

Who makes the safety?

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Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

Consigliere posted:

This thread will do for Hi Powers what the revolver and .22 rifle and pistol threads did......cost everyone a boatload of money.  That's why I love this place.

 

Yep. 

I have wanted a HP since I was a kid. Every time I get an email from Aim about them,  I seriously consider buying one. This thread is making it worse. 

____________________"Requiring the police to do and be everything for everyone at any time doesn’t make sense. If you expect cops to be able to stop bleeding; start hearts; change tires; calm the irrational; comfort the heartbroken; control schizophrenics when doctors can’t; straighten out unruly students when five teachers can’t; make life-and-death decisions in split seconds; learn city, state and federal case laws and be able to understand, remember and execute the intricacies of over 2,000 general orders in the blink of an eye while engaged in bizarrely chaotic and dangerous situations in the middle of the night …We may, as a society, be nuts." - Jim Glennon

Dorsai posted:
Gunner posted:

Couple years ago I was looking to buy a stock HP and trick it out.  Then I ran across this little guy.  The mag came with the pistol, they say made in Italy, I have no idea where to find mags that have that spring to eject the magazine but they are pretty handy.  My only gripe is I can barely feel the trigger reset. 

 

 

Who makes the safety?

Don Williams does a safety identical to that- he welds a small "shelf" on the Mk II / Mk III improved safety. He did it on my strong side and it works great.

PRAISE THE FALLEN

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1Lt Nick Dewhirst KIA 20-July-08          PFC Jason Watson KIA 10-Feb-09

CPL Charles Gaffney KIA 24-Dec-08

 

Joined: 2/21/04          Location: Seattle,  WA

Thanks, I had no idea who makes that safety.  The gun store guy said all the work was Novak, but his safety is a bit different.  Jim Garthwait also makes one similar.

"A pirate is not the sort of a man who generally cares to pay his bills...and after a time the work of endeavoring to collect debts from pirates was given up."

          -Frank R. Stockton

Hp deals are out there to be had, and you have the FEG clone that in some ways a bargain step ahead ( larger/easier safety)  that is hp parts interchangeable .  There is also the 80s styled Israeli clone (starts with a k I think) that is internally the same, just a  more angular appearance

Location Texas.

 

"So what are you gonna do if we get hit on this trip?" "Me?, I'm going to shoot some good pics of you nuking their ass. You do your job, I'll do mine. If I have to do yours,(unless you're the medic) we're probably all screwed!" - Standard reply , from Desert Storm through Iraqi Freedom

 

 The Argentine guns are supposed to be very good also.

The "Browning" High Powers have always been made by FN, I think C&S report the new ones "assembled in Portugal" with the cast frames are tougher then the older forged ones.

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"Good landing, good fight, and good luck" James M. Gavin 09Jul43

 "they say if it works, it's a good tactic...I say anything can work once" 

Consigliere posted:

This thread will do for Hi Powers what the revolver and .22 rifle and pistol threads did......cost everyone a boatload of money.  That's why I love this place.

If only I could get one in MA. The only way possible is to find one used that is already in the state, or a C&R (I'm not sure there are any). I'd trade the .40 for a 9mm if I could.

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Joined: 1/30/06 3:34 PM - Location:MA

I've got a Mk II in the safe I purchased in the mid 80's.  Carried it for a while when I worked for an agency where you brought your own gun to work.  It's been 100% reliable with good ammo and quite accurate.  

I keep meaning to take it up to Novak and have better sights put on it but haven't managed to in the last 30 years of living an hour south of him.

Rick R2 posted:

I've got a Mk II in the safe I purchased in the mid 80's.  Carried it for a while when I worked for an agency where you brought your own gun to work.  It's been 100% reliable with good ammo and quite accurate.  

I keep meaning to take it up to Novak and have better sights put on it but haven't managed to in the last 30 years of living an hour south of him.

You are a better man then I, if I was that close I would be buying Hi Powers and 1911's just to take to him.

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"Good landing, good fight, and good luck" James M. Gavin 09Jul43

 "they say if it works, it's a good tactic...I say anything can work once" 

The FEG HP clones are quite good and there are always several on GB for the $250's and make good project base guns.

 

 

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I think the Israeli ones were called Kareens. Everytime  In the past that I got this close to buying an HP the hamner bite issue stopped me. Now with a little more of a dispoasble income and a bit more knowledge on HP 'Smiths might be a good time to pick up a used one.  Ironically , a few months ago buddy showed me a Mauser made Hi Power that was 1970-80's(?) made. 

The wife has an FEG as her "beater" HP and likes it almost better than her Belgian. My beater is an Israeli return Belgian that looks rough as hell but shoots good. Almost all of mine have the low profile Craig Spegel Presentation Grip Panels grips. I get them from Garthwaite (http://www.garthwaite.com/) for a good price ($70) (http://garthwaite.myshopify.com/collections/parts) and it slims down the grip to perfection. That is what the one in the pic is wearing as well as his steel light rail. This reminds me, I need to order two more sets of grips for my 40S&W HPs

Location Texas.

 

"So what are you gonna do if we get hit on this trip?" "Me?, I'm going to shoot some good pics of you nuking their ass. You do your job, I'll do mine. If I have to do yours,(unless you're the medic) we're probably all screwed!" - Standard reply , from Desert Storm through Iraqi Freedom

Hi All, 

At the risk of turning this into a gun porn thread, but to also turn it into some thing that will cost Con some $$, this is my Novak tuned P35.  It started as a base, new man MKIII (Wayne Novak has a huge bench stock of Hi-Powers, so if you want a collector, he can probably help you, if you want a shooter, he recommends the MKIII). In addition to  their sights (and a really nice Gold Dot front) it has their hammer and strong side only extended safety.  The Spegel Grips just add to the package. 

Though I have Milt Sparks VM leather for it, so far (365 rounds, 115, 124,147gr, ball and JHP, No malfunctions) I've only used it on the range.  It is clearly one of those pistols that shoot better than I can on a good day.  The trigger face is polished and slightly radius'd and break very cleanly at about 5 lbs.  

Definitely a old-school piece, but I really wanted one to replace the stock Belgian 1980's P35 I stupidly sold and this one is it and a great shooter too. 

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Joined: 29 May 2008          Location: AZ

As much as I love them, with our mag ban, I have no interest in another full size, 10 round 9mm.  Sad but saves me from myself I guess.

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IT'S A COLT.  THEY'RE LIKE THE HK OF GUNS.

  

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Joined: 28 Nov 2004: 0037hrs        Location: The worst run state in the U.S

I could much easier get behind a 10 round BHP, then a G17, G19, M&PFS, or most of the other mid to full size 9mms

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"Good landing, good fight, and good luck" James M. Gavin 09Jul43

 "they say if it works, it's a good tactic...I say anything can work once" 

GNX posted:

Ironically , a few months ago buddy showed me a Mauser made Hi Power that was 1970-80's(?) made. 

Those are actually FEG made HP's that were rebranded "Mauser" for export IIRC. 

PRAISE THE FALLEN

SSG Kevin Roberts KIA 7-May-08         SPC Peter Courcy KIA 10-Feb-09

1Lt Nick Dewhirst KIA 20-July-08          PFC Jason Watson KIA 10-Feb-09

CPL Charles Gaffney KIA 24-Dec-08

 

Joined: 2/21/04          Location: Seattle,  WA

kaltesherz posted:
GNX posted:

Ironically , a few months ago buddy showed me a Mauser made Hi Power that was 1970-80's(?) made. 

Those are actually FEG made HP's that were rebranded "Mauser" for export IIRC. 

Thanks for the cool info! Wow what a lineage,USA Designer of a Belgian pistol, Hungarian made, exported to Germany and branded to sell in the US ( I think?)

Just to keep the waters from getting too muddy.

Argentine Hi-Powers.  There are two broad classifications, military and civilian.  The ones made by FM (Fabrique Militar) are license made at an FN licensed plant.  They are interchangeable with the later version with an external extractor, not the internal.  They are good quality and I've owned one or two.

The Civilian versions are another story.  They ones you get new, commercial, are not the same quality.  They are rougher and they no longer make the traditional Hi-Power scallops at the front of the slide.  Instead, they look like a 1911.  They also make a shortened version called the Detective.  A friend of mine got one and I spent 20 minutes trying to get the full length recoil spring guide rod installed because of a very tiny alignment tolerance.  I didn't like it, but hey, whatever floats your boat.

The FEG comes in a standard SA model that pretty much duplicates the FN version.  I "think" all the parts and the magazines will interchange.  BUT, they also make a DA version with a slide mounted decocking safety and NOTHING interchanges.  Even the magazine is different.  So be careful if you just focus on FEG and forget the other details.

Bulgaria also makes a "copy" called the Arcus.  The Arcus 94 is a "clone" and they have a compact version called the Arcus 94c.  But they also branched out and made a DA version.  The contours on the slide and frame are more angular and "modern" .  Same friend picked up one of those and I didn't like it.  Standard magazines fit, but the feel of the gun was way off, no longer comfortable and forget finding a holster.

In general, it seems that the clone makers stay close to the standard in their earliest examples.  It is when they keep making them and decide to make improvements that things go south.  If you don't want to buy new, don't hesitate to buy used if you can take a good look at the gun.  I bought one of the Israeli guns back in '99.  The barrel was dirty and the epoxy finish was scarred, scraped and just terrible.  I almost sent it back.  But on close examination, none of the finish where actually impacted the metal.  A brush and patch down the barrel and it was bright and shiny.  After stripping it down and bead blasting everything, it looked brand new.  I'd rather go that route than get a clone with possibly questionable metallurgy and parts compatibility.

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Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

Dorsai posted:

Just to keep the waters from getting too muddy.

A

In general, it seems that the clone makers stay close to the standard in their earliest examples.  It is when they keep making them and decide to make improvements that things go south.  If you don't want to buy new, don't hesitate to buy used if you can take a good look at the gun.  I bought one of the Israeli guns back in '99.  The barrel was dirty and the epoxy finish was scarred, scraped and just terrible.  I almost sent it back.  But on close examination, none of the finish where actually impacted the metal.  A brush and patch down the barrel and it was bright and shiny.  After stripping it down and bead blasting everything, it looked brand new.  I'd rather go that route than get a clone with possibly questionable metallurgy and parts compatibility.

...and don't touch the Indonesian ones with a barge pole. If you have to, get the latest one on offer.

To add to the overall oo ah , my good high power, 

I got it used as it sits- Novaked, NP3 Plus, sights, stippling, extended safety,  extended mag release, Spegal grips,  trigger job

imageimage

Location Texas.

 

"So what are you gonna do if we get hit on this trip?" "Me?, I'm going to shoot some good pics of you nuking their ass. You do your job, I'll do mine. If I have to do yours,(unless you're the medic) we're probably all screwed!" - Standard reply , from Desert Storm through Iraqi Freedom

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R.Moran posted:

 

The "Browning" High Powers have always been made by FN,

Bob, is there a difference between the "Browning" HPs and those produced by the thousands in Canada after the fall of Belgium (actually, well after as they weren't issued until 1944...)?  We still use them and always simply refer to them as "Brownings".  Canadian HPs kitted out the forces of freedom at the end of the war including the "Chinese" models.

Joined sometime in 2008.                  Live in Canada.        

com cam guy posted:

To add to the overall oo ah , my good high power, 

I got it used as it sits- Novaked, NP3 Plus, sights, stippling, extended safety,  extended mag release, Spegal grips,  trigger job

 

Nice BHP.  Idle question: how long did it take to have this done?  I'm thinking were a chap to go through the export/import rigmarole & give his BHP to Novak with plenty of notice on the next trip...

I don't know on Novak's  timeline for this as this is how I bought it used (stupid level deal I couldn't pass up)  I would talk to them directly. 

Location Texas.

 

"So what are you gonna do if we get hit on this trip?" "Me?, I'm going to shoot some good pics of you nuking their ass. You do your job, I'll do mine. If I have to do yours,(unless you're the medic) we're probably all screwed!" - Standard reply , from Desert Storm through Iraqi Freedom

libertarian45 posted:
R.Moran posted:

 

The "Browning" High Powers have always been made by FN,

Bob, is there a difference between the "Browning" HPs and those produced by the thousands in Canada after the fall of Belgium (actually, well after as they weren't issued until 1944...)?  We still use them and always simply refer to them as "Brownings".  Canadian HPs kitted out the forces of freedom at the end of the war including the "Chinese" models.

I was referring to the brand "Browning", not the generic term.

I'm no collector, so I could not tell you of the the difference and nuances that make up the Inglis guns.

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"Good landing, good fight, and good luck" James M. Gavin 09Jul43

 "they say if it works, it's a good tactic...I say anything can work once" 

Any idea who made the later Charles Daly versions that came with Big Dot sights and an upgraded safety? I recall seeing them in the early 2000s and thought they were going for too good of a price to be good.

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I've been falling so long it's like gravity's gone & I'm just floating...

Picked mine up today.  The finish is exactly as expected, the grip screws are a rusty mess, I got one with an ambi-safety and lanyard loop.  The rear sight is not only small, but half gone from wear or something - not broken, just worn down/smashed.  None of this really matters as I plan on addressing all of it personally.  The trigger isn't terrible - not a 1911, and not much in the way of feedback on reset, but far from terrible.  Interestingly, cycling the slide feels like it's on greased bearings.  Unbelievably smooth.  It must just be a function of the design, because nothing about the condition of this particular example suggests it should feel so slick.  Maybe my senses have just been dulled by handling almost nothing but factory Glocks for the past year+.

As for the design itself, I love it.  Love the feel, love the control placement, love the size, the slimness, love the look.  Not thrilled about the magazine safety, and definitely not OK with the magazine not dropping free.   Is it true removing the magazine safety will allow the mag to drop free?  Just looking at it, it looks like yes.  If not, is there another way to address this?

I like the placement of the safety - plenty familiar from 1911s and AR-15s, I ride my thumb on both.  The size is a bit small, but workable.  The main problem (right now) is the off side, as it's ambidextrous.  It's doing what ambi-safetys frequently do to me, and bumping off my top knuckle on the right side and failing to fully disengage.  On the left side, it's a bit angular and bumps right up against a bone at the base of my thumb, which I foresee being obnoxious under recoil.  These are all things I can sort out, just not sure how I want to go about it.

It's 50/50 on whether or not this hammer is gonna bite me, only live rounds will tell.

I'd post a picture, but my phone is dead.  I'll put a couple up tomorrow for sure.  I haven't shot it yet, but this is possibly the best 1st impression a pistol has ever left on me.

For a lot of in-depth Hi-Power knowledge, check out Stephen A. Camp's site and click on the Browning Hi-Power tab:

http://www.hipowersandhandguns.com/index.html

Mr. Camp is deceased (hence the lack of updates), but the sight is a well known favorite for Hi-Power aficionados.

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The moral high ground is sometimes just a head on a long pike... - Astronomy

 

A new Plt Ldr is like a first time new mother. The Plt Sgt is a lifelong midwife and nanny. It's your baby but he knows a lot about changing diapers and other ugly things. - Astronomy

FN Hi-Powers are marked Browning for the US market and FN for everywhere else.  John Inglis made them in Canada during the war years for the allies, including China.  I'm guessing the Inglis was what you encountered in Canadian Forces.  They supplied the Brits for awhile until they got them direct from FN.

The Hi-Power invokes in me a lot of the same emotion I get from the fine revolvers in their thread.  Some people don't see "soul" in a gun.  They are just tools, to be used and discarded.  Ok, their choice and opinion.  Some don't consider the Hi-Power to be competitive compared to a polymer piece like the Glock, M&P, etc.  Again, fair enough when you are looking at things such as cost of manufacture, weight, parts interchangeability.  I can go with that, but they shoot just as good, if not better.

The design is adaptable.  You can swap out sights, thumb safety, remove the magazine safety and bob the hammer (if you need to), without going to a gunsmith.  When you're done, pretty much all your gripes are gone.  I like field stripping a Hi-Power over and above every other pistol.  Drop the magazine, retract the slide and lock it with the safety.  Push out the slide stop, pivot off the safety and remove the slide group off the front.  I tend to remove barrel and spring together.  Just grab the camming lug, push it forward and pull down to unlock it and everything comes out.  You could even safely disassemble it with a loaded magazine in place because you never touch the trigger or drop the hammer.

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Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

Had one as a primary for several active service tours. Had one as a secondary (and primary) also sometimes. Bog standard issue (Mk II). Reliable, accurate, did the job.

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If you want to go quickly, go alone. If you want to go far, go together    -    African proverb

 

Joined: 2003          Location: At home pretending to be retired (again).

MkIII added a firing pin safety.

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Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

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