Latest evolution of the RAID pack: The Fight or Flight Pack

jcustisredux posted:

"But please don't add bungee bottle carriers.  Those things are a snag hazard and PITA to use, and the bungee fails at the worst time".

I agree, and I think it will work better with the Velcro closures when the pocket isn't holding a bottle, or if they are tall enough , with the Nalgene in it.

 

Location Texas.

 

"So what are you gonna do if we get hit on this trip?" "Me?, I'm going to shoot some good pics of you nuking their ass. You do your job, I'll do mine. If I have to do yours,(unless you're the medic) we're probably all screwed!" - Standard reply , from Desert Storm through Iraqi Freedom

But that's kinda the issue.  The width of the pocket would have to be increased to fit a Nalgene, and the pocket would be too big to be Velcro'd shut evenly.  The mouth of the pocket would need some elastic around the mouth to close it when not it use and to add retention for a bottle; and we all know how iffy that can get over time.

It is better that they do it imperfectly than that you do it perfectly. For it is their war and their country and your time here is limited.

 

                                                                                                                        —T. E. Lawrence

 

 

POSREP: UAE

- The compression straps MUST stay. Anyone who has carried a decent load in the old RAID has probably had the problem of zippers coming open unless the zipper pulls had the compression strap run through them (The zipper pull cords need to be long enough to easily accommodate this). The side compression straps should be longer with elastic tabs to stow excess strap. I have run tons of extra shit on the sides of my pack like big jackets, sleeping mats, guns, skis, ski poles, etc. Having a simple strap that looks entirely common gives you a ton of versatility. Maintaining the common buckle configuration to the RAID also allows the use of legacy "additional" detachable pockets for assault packs. These make excellent shaving kits and other random things where you might want a detachable pouch. You could add a line of accessories like those in the civi line. 

- The side pockets on the legacy RAID are far from ideal because they push the load inside of the pack space. If the pockets were less rigid or had extra material to push outboard it would be more ideal. Think big ass ten-speed pouches on the side of the pack. These could accommodate large or small water bottles without excessive straps or velcro.  I am a big fan of side pockets but only use them when they make sense. 

- All of the radio ports should go. No reason for a port on a low profile travel pack except maybe for a camelback bladder. One port covered with elastic would suffice. The less shit that can get to my computer the happier I am. I also don't want a bunch of flaps that everyone who has ever looked at an assault pack knows are for antennas. 

- I need a lot less internal velcro. Either the back panel or the lid only. This will cut down on pack weight. If used on the lid, it would help to provide some structure to the pack. Also, because the zipper is on the lid side of the pack, your quickest access to the velcro would be on the lid side. If you want full velcro lining there are a ton of other manufacturers. Think about the best use of the pack here, why would you buy another pack and do the differences justify the cost? 

- The zipper on the lid would be better turned 90 degrees so you have a really long opening. I absolutely love this feature on other packs the more I use it. I can stuff really long but frequently accessible items like notebooks here so I don't need to open the main pack body. Works especially well if you are running a pistol and mags in the main body. Any junk in the outer pocket breaks up the pack outline well. 

- The velcro panel on the outside is meh. I can take it or leave it. Anyone who walks through an airport today will notice a shitload of men women and children carrying assault packs or camo packs. I don't think the velcro is a huge target indicator or deal breaker. If you are worried about that you need a completely different pack. If I want to make sure no one thinks I'm military I will carry a commonly available commercial pack. It may be less than optimal but it won't look like what it isn't. Hate to burst bubbles but guys who do Low Vis work aren't typically running some gucci assault pack. 

- The bottom flap would be awesome made out of Hypalon or something that was water resistant and could be laser cut MOLLE without it being overtly MOLLE. If you desire to get rid of that shit but add it back you're defeating yourself. If it was made out of a different abrasion resistant material it wouldn't look out of place. It would just look like an enhanced durability feature. 

- I would really love to see a separate zipper close to the back that can access a laptop sleeve. A pack missing a tech compartment is behind the times. I carry a computer or tablet everywhere I travel. The zipper and sleeve add some manufacturing complexity but are the feature that pushes me to buy a new pack versus another assault pack. The pictures look like Jimmy threw together a RAID in a different color but forgot the PALS webbing. I need something different than a RAID if I'm buying another pack. 

 

 

A couple more thoughts now that I looked back through the pictures. 

- The bungees and zipper pull's should be available in color-coordinated packs as options. Let me order red, blue, lime green, etc. bungees and zipper pull's that come in a tiny ziplock that I can install myself (thanks to a youtube link). You will save the install time and the user can select the accessories as an option when they select pack color during checkout. This adds diversity to the line although you would need to stock a few colors that would match up with the packs. Maybe 4 pack colors and 4 accessory colors so guys can mix and match at will. Honestly, I'd probably buy several different colors (or all of them) and swap occasionally to keep things interesting. 

- I like that the shoulder straps are being sewn down lower with the cross strap and they have added the load lifter straps. That solution engineers out the most common failure mode of the pack straps. The lower ends are usually fairly robust. I think every catastrophic pack failure I've had with an assault pack has been a strap failure. 

- The outer pocket on the face, that I suggested being turned 90 degrees might want to be an additional short pocket capable of carrying a glasses case or keys. I would love two outer pockets because of the increased capacity and versatility but it would add a slight cost. Frankly, that would be a great design, that I'd pay more for, but I know I'm probably not going to get everything I want. I would take the large vertical zipper only if I had to only choose one though. 

- I'm still good to load up a prototype and see how she handles. I don't think you need any testing on what's posted as so many guys already have the RAID or Cobra so those are all standard features. 

 

How many people have looked at an assault pack?

My only major concern is that slab of concrete on the front. It doesn't have to be much, maybe a couple overlapping stash pockets, an angled zip pocket, or even just a 3" stripe of material similar to the (really fucking tiny) SKD Runt.

The bungee will alleviate this to an extent, but it looks out of place to me. I'm in a college town. I'm used to seeing all sorts of protuberances between the normal people who carry packs, the transients who carry packs, and the 40k+ students who carry packs. I'm not used to a featureless monochrome slab.

Then again I'm currently using the large compartment of a 5.11 Covert M4 as my EDC pack and no one seems to notice or care that it is an oddly long single strap bag.

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"A pistol is what you carry when you do not expect a problem. If you expect a problem you can't avoid, and you are not taking a long gun, you are not very smart." - DM

 

Joined: 04Nov2007         Location: Indiana

If a verticle zipper is added to create a pocket, having it close at the top minimzes shit coming out as you unzip the pocket.

It is better that they do it imperfectly than that you do it perfectly. For it is their war and their country and your time here is limited.

 

                                                                                                                        —T. E. Lawrence

 

 

POSREP: UAE

If I wasn't too retarded to post pictures I would show how the verticle zipper works in real life. I have both Arcteryx and TNF packs with the feature right now that work great. Usually, I'll kick the bag over on its side to unzip the front pockets. The opening must go at the top though, as noted. 

 
jcustisredux posted:

I am big on the side pockets, as I have used them a lot.  The method of closure isn't terribly important to me, nor the type of bottle it will hold (I just find the right-sized bottle that works, including plastic H2O bottles if necessary).   The side pocket mouth is not large enough, and  if you size it to fit a Nalgene, wouldn't that be problematic in terms of redesigning?

But please don't add bungee bottle carriers.  Those things are a snag hazard and PITA to use, and the bungee fails at the worst time.

This this this.

Side pockets add a measure of accessibility that alleviates having to open the main compartment all the time.   Using the sides for storage also means easy access from the top when a bag is between someone's legs or feet during transport.  I completely get the concerns of folks who don't want loads in side pockets to intrude into interior space, but even simple pleating of side pocket material can help that, as it allows the material to bellow out rather than in.

And another vote vs. bungee or mesh pockets.

jcustisredux posted:

But that's kinda the issue.  The width of the pocket would have to be increased to fit a Nalgene, and the pocket would be too big to be Velcro'd shut evenly.  The mouth of the pocket would need some elastic around the mouth to close it when not it use and to add retention for a bottle; and we all know how iffy that can get over time.

I kind of like how the end pockets on ENDOMs TNT bag fold when not in use but still fits a Nalgene.  However there might be Intellectual Property issues over copying directly from them.

For the ports, how about a single 10" zipper with sewn closed ends and two sliders that meet in the middle.  That way you can slide it to one side or the other depending on your preference for which shoulder you want the hose to go over/which side the antennae is on.  Have that compartment separate from the laptop one and with a drain hole in case the hydration bladder leaks.

In terms of colors, a wolf grey bag with portions in navy (like the side pockets!) would look right at home as a sports team equipment bag.  If there is a outside velcro patch I would slap a team logo on it.

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The flip side of the side pockets pushing into the pack space, is that they "*dont* push outwards, thus making the pack wider. This pack and the RAID are as wide as a pack should be without adding another 8 inches in width by way of a pair of Nalgenes.

Also, we're drifting off course here, a lot. I'm guilty of it too, but lets all refocus.

This is an update of the RAID pack, not a complete redesign. The changes Brad is making, different material/color, less sewing by removing PALS, adding some interior velcro, are all easy to do, and increase functionality without driving up cost, because 90% of the design is already in production. The goal is basically an F-150 in a different color with different upholstery, which is easy and cheap and it works. 

We've gone from "Lets update the RAID and make it lower profile" to "Lets add and move zippers, add bellows and velcro pockets and laptop sleeve slots and front slash pockets." Its exactly like Pentagon Wars: "Lets make a scout version... with a turret! And more armor! And missles!"

Brad, you're the man, and you've got a winner here. I'm looking forward to purchase.

 

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"The thing everyone forgets about the Chinese is that they work on a 50-100 year master plan. Our best planning here goes out maybe a year or two."

21M posted:

The flip side of the side pockets pushing into the pack space, is that they "*dont* push outwards, thus making the pack wider. This pack and the RAID are as wide as a pack should be without adding another 8 inches in width by way of a pair of Nalgenes.

And the current RAID dimensions are basically the footprint limit for an airplane carry on

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It's not that life is so short, it's that you're dead for so long.

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It's gone now, I wish you could've seen it"
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Hussar posted:
jcustisredux posted:

But that's kinda the issue.  The width of the pocket would have to be increased to fit a Nalgene, and the pocket would be too big to be Velcro'd shut evenly.  The mouth of the pocket would need some elastic around the mouth to close it when not it use and to add retention for a bottle; and we all know how iffy that can get over time.

I kind of like how the end pockets on ENDOMs TNT bag fold when not in use but still fits a Nalgene.  However there might be Intellectual Property issues over copying directly from them.

For the ports, how about a single 10" zipper with sewn closed ends and two sliders that meet in the middle.  That way you can slide it to one side or the other depending on your preference for which shoulder you want the hose to go over/which side the antennae is on.  Have that compartment separate from the laptop one and with a drain hole in case the hydration bladder leaks.

In terms of colors, a wolf grey bag with portions in navy (like the side pockets!) would look right at home as a sports team equipment bag.  If there is a outside velcro patch I would slap a team logo on it.

I like the zipper access for bladder, I still want the port. 

I have an older camelbak Hawg or REI daypack that I use the bladder compartment for laptop with the opening. I would have an empty nalgene, in the main compartment or dedicated side compartment depending on the pack. 

My source bladder would be in the checked luggage or carry on. If I needed a bladder my laptop was not usually along for the ride. I'd take a smaller tablet or just waterproof phone. I'd use a water bottle or bottled water for all Low profile/ "normal" people endeavors. Very few  people in a non outdoors setting around the world use a bladder. It is out of place unless actively running, hiking, or biking.  If I am in an environment where I need a bladder, I usually did not want a laptop.

After TSA check. I'd go buy a beer at the bar, then ask the bartender to fill my water bottle with soda water because sometimes I like fancy water lol.  Laptop in bladder compartment, and water in a sealed nalgene. 

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pack features that were dope AF

The REI daypack they no longer make had two nalgene compartments on with one on either side that was a tight fit with 3/4 zipper enclosure. The compartment had the wax like sealant on the inside to prevent water bleed thru from the elements. 

The camelbak hawgs water bladder compartment was padded and this was helpful for protecting the laptop.

 

my raid pack will fit the little water bottles or smart waters.  and if this is an urban themed bag CONUS. Potable drinking water is not unavailable, nor will smart water lol.

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TLDR: make the bladder compartment dual purpose    Please. Either use it for laptop and blend in OR put a bladder in it take it outside and be angry Spreading hate and discontent or walking outside. Nalgene carrier is nice but if I really need water, then I will use a bladder and it is not out of place, and buying bottled water is not an option and I will need more than 1L, I sweat a lot

 

 

 

 

 

 

"The facts, while interesting are irrelevant: It's not what you know that matters, it's what you don't know that tends to get people killed."

 

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21M posted:

...Also, we're drifting off course here, a lot. I'm guilty of it too, but lets all refocus.

This is an update of the RAID pack, not a complete redesign. The changes Brad is making, different material/color, less sewing by removing PALS, adding some interior velcro, are all easy to do, and increase functionality without driving up cost, because 90% of the design is already in production...

+1. Seeing the prototype, I have another several good ideas (because I am brilliant) but am keeping them to myself to keep development costs down, stay in focus. 

ETA: doing the same for work right now. Dev showing off what they built, and I want to fix some stuff... but design is locked so we can debug (and we are griping) but despite having even usability tests, I cannot actually change anything. 

I need a drink. 

Luckily, my Balvenie bottle is about the diameter if a 1l Nalgene so will fit in the side pocket. Lagavulin on the other side. To balance it out.

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

21M posted:

The flip side of the side pockets pushing into the pack space, is that they "*dont* push outwards, thus making the pack wider. This pack and the RAID are as wide as a pack should be without adding another 8 inches in width by way of a pair of Nalgenes.

Also, we're drifting off course here, a lot. I'm guilty of it too, but lets all refocus.

This is an update of the RAID pack, not a complete redesign. The changes Brad is making, different material/color, less sewing by removing PALS, adding some interior velcro, are all easy to do, and increase functionality without driving up cost, because 90% of the design is already in production. The goal is basically an F-150 in a different color with different upholstery, which is easy and cheap and it works. 

We've gone from "Lets update the RAID and make it lower profile" to "Lets add and move zippers, add bellows and velcro pockets and laptop sleeve slots and front slash pockets." Its exactly like Pentagon Wars: "Lets make a scout version... with a turret! And more armor! And missles!"

Brad, you're the man, and you've got a winner here. I'm looking forward to purchase.

This.

When I posted my thoughts on a less military/tactical RAID in the original thread, all I really wanted was to basically create a bigger Cobra 2.6 for lower profile travel.

Not redesign a new pack with every bell and whistle. If guys want to get their tactical on, then get a RAID. If you want a laptop bag, then get one. If you want something else, then get it.

Take a Cobra and just make it fatter. Nothing more, nothing less. I am typing this with my Wolf Grey RAID, and my Wolf Grey Cobra 2.6 on the table in front of me.

Wolf Grey RAID:

20171213_173757

Wolf Grey Cobra 2.6:

20171213_173807

Top of Cobra 2.6 showing port:

20171213_173826

Inside Cobra 2.6 showing velcro

20171213_173854

Bottom of Cobra 2.6 showing MOLLE:

20171213_174853

It has compression straps, a single hydration port covered with elastic, MOLLE on the bottom, bungie attachment system, velcro inside, and is grey (or other non tactical colour).

Regards.

Mark

Formerly known as ML

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Lightfighter posted:

3. Compression straps aren't just a feature, they are the soul of a combat pack, slick or otherwise. This pack with removable compression straps wouldn't be the same pack. They are a necessity.

With regards to the compression straps - even for those that want them - is there truly a benefit having them sewn in and dedicated, as apposed to removable via dedicated loops using a combination of split-bar buckles and G-hooks? If you supply loops in the right places, the user can decide between bungee,  strap - or both.

Sewing in loops, and offering bungee or strap/buckle/g-hook options would simplify things.

Kifaru have been running K-Klips (their version of G Hooks) for their compression straps on their heavy haulers for a few years. If the pack and stitch work is done right, it shouldn't be an issue.

Regarding the side pockets - for as long as I've used my various RAID's, I've always used a side pocket to house my hydration bladder. A tall/skinny 2L bladder sits perfectly in them. Also, for the simple act of reducing bulk, a lot of people have switched from a fat 32oz Nalgene, to a tall/skinny 24oz Nalgene. Also perfectly suited for the side pockets.

And since I'm already on a ramble, I'll throw in an additional 2 bob.

Line the interior with high-viz orange. It's a Godsend when searching through a pack.

As apposed to a inner Velcro backing, the RAID II's interior of 4 simple tri-glides is more than enough. If and end use needs/wants a dedicated Velcro/PALS panel, there are aftermarket companies that produce such a thing. Heck. ATS could even make one specific for this pack. It's be a pretty simple piece to make, and you're not asking customers to buy shit they don't need.

 

_____________________________ Get a dog up ya!

rooks posted:

With regards to the compression straps - even for those that want them - is there truly a benefit having them sewn in and dedicated, as apposed to removable via dedicated loops using a combination of split-bar buckles and G-hooks? If you supply loops in the right places, the user can decide between bungee,  strap - or both.

Sewing in loops, and offering bungee or strap/buckle/g-hook options would simplify things.

Kifaru have been running K-Klips (their version of G Hooks) for their compression straps on their heavy haulers for a few years. If the pack and stitch work is done right, it shouldn't be an issue.

+1

Sewn-in dedicated compression straps are NOT  the only way to go for a hard use pack, contrary to popular belief. 

Kifaru:


Hill People Gear:


Lightfighter posted:

3. Compression straps aren't just a feature, they are the soul of a combat pack, slick or otherwise. This pack with removable compression straps wouldn't be the same pack. They are a necessity.

Nothing would be lost regarding the heart & soul of a RAID pack by improving the manner in which compression straps are integrated & used, it's an improvement that would add it the RAID's capability and versatility... not take away from it.

If not for my lack of sewing ability and equipment I would've removed the stock compression straps long ago, so I think I'll have to disagree with you on their necessity.

As for laptop carriage, not needed. With the Velcro inner of the SLICK raid you could add an LBX  Velcro backed laptop pouch, they have a 13" and 15" model. Originally designed for the Arc Khard/Assault series, but no reason why it wouldn't work on any Velcro lined pack. Stick that to the front flap and BOOM, easy protected access for your laptop, without adding anything extra for the pack.

http://lbxtactical.lbtinc.com/1006c

 

EDIT - Not  a Velcro backed pouch. My bad, thought they were. Carry on. *scuttles back to his lane*

 

EDIT EDIT - CTOMS does make one, but only upto a 14" laptop. http://ctoms.ca/Mission-Essent...top-case-insert.html

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I really like the idea of just expanding the Cobra2.6 into a RAID size and adding Nalgene capable pockets to the sides.

this Cobra Pack has been awesome but just a tad on the small size... though my favorite aspect is the non tactical color.

The single port is nice but there is no hanger inside to attach your hydro to.

The sternum straps are big enough for most barrel chested freedom fighters.

The bungie is great, but I think the loops there would be of better use if they were doubled, that was use could attach after market strap kits (Kclips/ G-hooks) to the bag for added strappage/ Gear retention. 

x4 Internal loops for using addition Kclips or G-Hooks to secure items internally that don’t have/ require Velcro backing  

I would absolutely lighten the color of the interior Velcro as well... HiViz Orange has its perks but also it’s detractors.  Maybe offer it as an option, but otherwise I’d go with a light gray or similar end of the color spectrum  

The addition of a REMOVEABLE waist belt would be a good call on a RAID size. 

And lastly the shoulder straps would need to be beefed up with a bit more padding. 

"Freedom Isn't Free"
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Tactical450 posted:

 

And lastly the shoulder straps would need to be beefed up with a bit more padding. 

I have a RAID 2 with the thinner, less padded straps than the RAID and A-III packs, and they're a lot more comfortable, even with loads exceeding 25lbs. They ride better, move with you better, and because of those, they don't rub you the way super padded (and thus super stiff) straps do. 

The straps alone are why I stopped using my A-III packs in favor of my RAID II and gave them away to friends. I actually like the A-III layout and style a lot more, and I think LBT missed a huge opportunity when they brought it back in 2016 in modern colors, but no real design updates. 

 

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"The thing everyone forgets about the Chinese is that they work on a 50-100 year master plan. Our best planning here goes out maybe a year or two."

crazypaulie posted:

As much as I like g-hooks - I have a chest rig that uses them to attach the placard and when not under load they continuously fall off...

And on my PIG Brig PC I have a tough time getting my g-hooks unhooked on my 3 mag placard, even with no load. I only take them off if I’m going to be in it for a long time and I want to be slick and light. 

Mojo/Mark
__________________________
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Joined: 9/30/09
Location: Northern Nevada (Reno/Sparks)

I have the metal style G-hooks on my FirstSpear packs, and quite frankly they suck. I like almost everything else about the packs.

Every time I put the pack down, they unhook themselves when not under load, and have to be re-attached when I put the pack back on.

My fix is to ziptie them in place.

Regards.

Mark

Formerly known as ML

I remember seeing somebody out there making a pack with a yellow interior.

_____________________________________________

 

Doug

If I mention Corona, I ain't talking about beer.

Keepers of the light. Healers of the night. OH1dmat.org

 

JOINED:  9/20/09     LOCATION:  Outside of KSA Finally!

yakc130 posted:

I remember seeing somebody out there making a pack with a yellow interior.

Spec-ops

---------------------------------

It's not that life is so short, it's that you're dead for so long.

The .45-70 is the only government I trust

"I was raised in a place called America...
It's gone now, I wish you could've seen it"
- Moustache_6 quoting a WWII vet

 

Joined: 1/30/06 3:34 PM - Location:MA

Seeing non tactical types doing it even. I have a random cheap Amazon padded camera insert for my briefcase thingy that is yellow instead of black, and it is the only reason I can find anything in there. 

The GG LW Assault Pack (maybe more GG stuff but I have this one) is da-glo orange (like viz panel orange) on the panel separating the hydro carrier from the main pack area. I noticed that this is so effective at being bright it lights up the whole interior, so I have done the same on some stuff I sewed; I made a lid for my ruck that has maybe 1/5th of the interior in da-glo orange cordura and it is like there's a light on the one side. 

ANY bit of bright interior helps. If e.g. the panel velcro is way too expensive in anything but black, that's fine as long as some other area is light colored, or actually bright.

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

crazypaulie posted:

As much as I like g-hooks - I have a chest rig that uses them to attach the placard and when not under load they continuously fall off...

MOJONIXON posted:

And on my PIG Brig PC I have a tough time getting my g-hooks unhooked on my 3 mag placard, even with no load. I only take them off if I’m going to be in it for a long time and I want to be slick and light. 

MWL posted:

I have the metal style G-hooks on my FirstSpear packs, and quite frankly they suck. I like almost everything else about the packs.

Every time I put the pack down, they unhook themselves when not under load, and have to be re-attached when I put the pack back on.

G-Hooks  are quick & easy to attach, but there are definitely more than adequate alternatives with split-bar/repair hardware - the best being ladderlocs, and possibly even tri-glides.

(pics stolen from milspecmonkey)

_____________________________ Get a dog up ya!

I have a couple things that have come with Slik Clips for much this purpose. Optional strap attachment, not super easy to take on and off, but minimal profile. It would seem not too far off base to sew short loops, install the clip which is attached to the strap, remove if you hate it. 

If they have the pull strength for compression straps. 

But it also reminds me of another issue I have with many cool features: How do we know about them? I still am pretty sure I am doing something wrong with my Erbelstock, because it's so very full of straps and clips, and modular bits. We need manuals with packs these days. 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

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Malpaso posted:
yakc130 posted:

I remember seeing somebody out there making a pack with a yellow interior.

Spec-ops

That's it!

This loop concept with the add on straps is something I'm finding interesting. My current packs all have compression straps sewn in. Some don't compress down as much as I want, or the straps feel like they are sewn on in the wrong direction.  With the loops, I could put the straps on in whichever direction that I want them to go.

_____________________________________________

 

Doug

If I mention Corona, I ain't talking about beer.

Keepers of the light. Healers of the night. OH1dmat.org

 

JOINED:  9/20/09     LOCATION:  Outside of KSA Finally!

Malpaso posted:
yakc130 posted:

I remember seeing somebody out there making a pack with a yellow interior.

Spec-ops

The PIG Runt pack also has a really bright yellow interior. 

Mojo/Mark
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Yo homey, is that my briefcase...?
Vincent from "Collateral"
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You want the good life, you break your back, you snap your fingers, you snap your neck... Prong/Demon Hunter

Joined: 9/30/09
Location: Northern Nevada (Reno/Sparks)

 
crazypaulie posted:

As much as I like g-hooks - I have a chest rig that uses them to attach the placard and when not under load they continuously fall off...

MOJONIXON posted:

And on my PIG Brig PC I have a tough time getting my g-hooks unhooked on my 3 mag placard, even with no load. I only take them off if I’m going to be in it for a long time and I want to be slick and light. 

MWL posted:

I have the metal style G-hooks on my FirstSpear packs, and quite frankly they suck. I like almost everything else about the packs.

Every time I put the pack down, they unhook themselves when not under load, and have to be re-attached when I put the pack back on.


All of the short comings with the G-Hook have been addressed in the K-Clip design:




The above mentioned problems are also a non-issue with the use of ITW-Nexus buckles:


Moving away from hard sewn compression straps & buckles would be a minor change, with large improvement to the standard design in my opinion.  Such a minor tweaking shouldn't have a significant impact the established production method or cost.  But it seems like the majority of people feel better having hard sewn compression straps, so further discussion on this point seems counter-productive as it wouldn't be in ATS's best interest to produce a product with features that only a minority of the customer pool desire.
Moustache_6 posted:

...Moving away from hard sewn compression straps & buckles would be a minor change, with large improvement to the standard design in my opinion.  Such a minor tweaking shouldn't have a significant impact the established production method or cost.  But it seems like the majority of people feel better having hard sewn compression straps, so further discussion on this point seems counter-productive as it wouldn't be in ATS's best interest to produce a product with features that only a minority of the customer pool desire.

Thinking of typical design solution approaches to address the customizer without annoying the everyday, out-of-box user: 

Wouldn't it be +/- the same cost to use repair hardware vs solid loops, assemble at the factory, but those few who know can remove the compression straps if they want? 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

fishnshoot posted:
sky potato posted:

I also like the mesh pockets and small Velcro pocket on the inside of the front flap from the original RAID

+1 for the frame sheet and hydro ports

One of the features I missed the most on the COBRA and RAID II  was that small Velcro pocket on the inside of the Original RAID. 

I think that pocket was handy and I felt like the newer packs were just not complete without that feature. 

Why not bring this back? Maybe just the top mesh pocket and the Velcro flat pocket

For one you have some organization, on the inside of the pack and a handy feature, that is covert, Plus room below to add your own Velcro backed pouches. 

Maybe remove the ports and try a Mystery Ranch feature on the pack, the zippered hydration/cable port.

TAG also did this About 2 years ago I picked up a TAG RAID ( I  don't want to go down that rabbit hole)  But that pack has the added zipper on top and I think it's a great feature.

Photo Dec 17, 18 31 32

Photo Dec 17, 18 31 52

Sorry Brad, I feel kinda dirty posting these pics.

I don't know how much this adds to cost, but it make a fairly covert feature that

gets the job done. 

Bless the Lord, who is my rock.  He gives me strength for war and skill for battle. PS 144:1

 

It's ok to be open minded, just don't let your brain fall out!

 

Joined: 19 Nov 2002    Location: The BLUE turf, ID

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On an another note, I just got back from a personal trip CONUS. I had the opportunity to witness many packs in the wild especially in Washington DC.

This may sound dumb, and may revoke my speaking privileges but I'm not a fan of grey. All the people wearing grey tactical bags stood out, they all had "contractor look". Grey is the new multi cam. 

Dont get me wrong, grey has a place. 

Is it possible to have a bag in a LL Bean esque colors they are the bright greens, lite blues and fuck I'd even take a bright yellow bag and what not?

I need my bag to be so tactically not cool that it does stand out in an urban environment in the most dumb tactical way and is something you'd be made fun for posting on social media or hell even here on LF.  That a reasonable person would be like that's not remotely tactical but an incredibly ugly color bag with a person that has horrible fashion. I had a problem with my vertex messenger bag in grey, somebody recognized the make and was like oh I have this and that in their bag. I don't need an IG whore to be able to recognize the grey and put two and two together. Maybe my needs are bit much, I hope not. 

I would love to be able to have low profile bag that can pass the Low profile sniff test without modding a commercial civilian bag to suit my needs and not be nearly as robust as the RAID.

Does anyone have thoughts on this color approach as well?

 

 

"The facts, while interesting are irrelevant: It's not what you know that matters, it's what you don't know that tends to get people killed."

 

"Nobelesse Oblige"

BigOaf posted:

 

/snip 

All of my professional work bags have been black.

Every business oriented manufacturer does, has always, and will always, make bags in black.

50% of the outdoors market, from fanny packs to day packs to hardcore backpacking packs, are available in black.

"Target indicator black" is a thing... on the battlefield.

In the civilian world, I've always found it to blend in the easiest, especially if you dont have any MOLLE, and have a couple of bright bits on there to soften it up (like orange zipper pulls, blue bungie cords, or a full color brand patch).

 

----

"The thing everyone forgets about the Chinese is that they work on a 50-100 year master plan. Our best planning here goes out maybe a year or two."

The bag needs to go from transport phase to a user’s back during offensive/tactical ops. That’s why a subdued color was suggested.

It is better that they do it imperfectly than that you do it perfectly. For it is their war and their country and your time here is limited.

 

                                                                                                                        —T. E. Lawrence

 

 

POSREP: UAE

21M posted:
BigOaf posted:

 

/snip 

All of my professional work bags have been black.

Every business oriented manufacturer does, has always, and will always, make bags in black.

50% of the outdoors market, from fanny packs to day packs to hardcore backpacking packs, are available in black.

"Target indicator black" is a thing... on the battlefield.

In the civilian world, I've always found it to blend in the easiest, especially if you dont have any MOLLE, and have a couple of bright bits on there to soften it up (like orange zipper pulls, blue bungie cords, or a full color brand patch).

Agreed.  As an overworked IT nerd, virtually everyone I work with sports a black nylon backpack of some sort.  My minions are issued a black Cordura briefcase to hold their laptops.

Just keep the MOLLE off the outside, and you lower the scrutiny by 90 percent. 

jcustisredux posted:

The bag needs to go from transport phase to a user’s back during offensive/tactical ops. That’s why a subdued color was suggested.

Unless the user is changing from blend in civilian clothing to a full camo uniform on the fly in the middle of a desert/forest/jungle, I don't see black being a detriment to someone walking down the boulevard in jeans and a hoodie.

 

----

"The thing everyone forgets about the Chinese is that they work on a 50-100 year master plan. Our best planning here goes out maybe a year or two."

I still tend to think gray with colorful accent would do. Bungee... or if the compression straps are not hard sewn that could also be modified/mixed-and-matched at unskilled assembly after sewing production. 

For color thinking, here's REI's daypacks page: 

https://www.rei.com/c/day-pack...day-packs&page=1

And the top several colors at an unscientific glance, sampled and turned into swatches in no particular order.

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

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