Low power Variable optic for patrol

MCorbin posted:

WF45, thank you for your thoughts on the new Burris. 

Question for you: if you're running a white light and go into a darkened room, can you still see the reticle? Can you make hits on a hostile human size target under those conditions? I'm sure in the NM desert sun the black horseshoe works just fine, but it's under those circumstances where "not daylight bright" starts to worry me. My only real point of reference is with Aimpoints. I know it's different,  but is it workable?  The price is what is really attracting me, but even the really high end LPV scope's seem to be mostly "not daylight bright ".

I have very limited experience here, but did get to do a brief night shoot back in August at FOP.  I was using an Eotech Vudu 1-6, which is not as bright as many other options.  Also, I had left my spare batteries in the hotel, so during the night shoot I was using just the black reticle.  We were shooting onto white targets, and I was using a Surefire Scout Ultra.  I had zero problems engaging without illumination on those targets.  Had they been darker targets or 3D targets with dark clothing, my results may have been different.  On my particular scope, though, the reticle is bold enough to use without illumination in most conditions.

"If you can't do something smart, do something right" -Jayne Cobb

 

Joined: 2010.                 Location: NOVA HELL

High Exposure posted:

If you are looking at Vortex give them a call or email. They have an excellent Good Guy discount for first responders and .mil (active and ex/retired). I think you are allowed to buy 4 Vortex items a year with your discount.

I have a Strike Eagle 1-6 and I am very impressed with it. It's not a Razor HD model but it's 1/4 the price and IMO it is a lot of scope for the money.

HE any additional feedback w/ that 1-6 Strike Eagle after a few months?

Asking as a Fed TF bud just picked up the 1-8 model SE, seems to like it but haven’t caught up yet w/ him to coon finger it. Like ya said it’s not a Razor HD but given the sale $ he got it for from DSG I’m looking hard @ one when they’re back in stock there.

Joined: 3.28.09            

Location: NETX

If you've got the $$, the Swarovski Z6i 1-6x is arguably the very best LPVO today.  However with 2018 right around the corner, who knows what new LPVO goodness will be unveiled at SHOT.

So if you're in the market for an LPVO it might be wise to hold off until after SHOT2018.  At least if nothing new strikes your fancy, you ought to be able to increase that scope budget enough to expand your options.

WyattT posted:

If you are LE/mil the discount program makes the razor hard to beat. Its a great deal, and the 1-6 mrad or bdc reticle are great options

FYI . . . Vortex sells to LE/MIL via Experticitydotcom nowadays, not from Vortex itself. 

Pretty easy to sign up.  Know that you'll have to wait a few weeks or maybe more for it to ship, but 40% off MSRP is appealing (I bought a Razor HD  II 4.5-27x56 and accessories).

 

C Walley posted:

Is the 1-6x Strike Eagle daylight bright?

I would say no... but also that it didnt bother me much. I was out hunting with mine this weekend, and when it was overcast, the brigthest setting would show up very slightly. But  the crosshair/horseshoe  with no illumination still drew my eye well.

 

"Here I abandon peace and desecrate law. Farewell to treaties. Fortune it is you I follow... From now on, war will be my judge."

Given the offerings they have come out with in the past couple years, some may consider it dated, but for my money, the Trijicon TR24 is really hard to beat. I've got one on my AR deer rifle and never considered replacing it. On 1x, you would have to use a timer to tell if it was faster than a T2. 

Crash41984 posted:

...On 1x, you would have to use a timer to tell if it was faster than a T2. 

That's exactly what you should do. Collect data and measure the difference between the LPVO and your red dot at CQB distances. Whether or not the data matters is up to the shooter, but get the data. The shot timer is the measuring tape I use when I want to know if a technique or piece of equipment is affecting how fast I do something.

That said, the TR24 is still a good optic in spite of newer offerings.

 

Know what you know; Know what you don't know. -Paul Petzoldt

MG in TX posted:
High Exposure posted:

If you are looking at Vortex give them a call or email. They have an excellent Good Guy discount for first responders and .mil (active and ex/retired). I think you are allowed to buy 4 Vortex items a year with your discount.

I have a Strike Eagle 1-6 and I am very impressed with it. It's not a Razor HD model but it's 1/4 the price and IMO it is a lot of scope for the money.

HE any additional feedback w/ that 1-6 Strike Eagle after a few months?

Asking as a Fed TF bud just picked up the 1-8 model SE, seems to like it but haven’t caught up yet w/ him to coon finger it. Like ya said it’s not a Razor HD but given the sale $ he got it for from DSG I’m looking hard @ one when they’re back in stock there.

Not HE, but I've got some thoughts - I had a SE 1-6x for about a year, ended up selling it to a coworker earlier this month (I've got a red dot in the interim while I research LPVOs). The glass was decent but sucked in low light and the full-retard illumination of the reticle turned me off. I wanted a dot, not a light show. That being said, with a throw lever it did the job, held zero fine, survived abuse, etc. For a budget optic it was ok, but again - the glass quality just isn't there.

I'm going to go look at the Vortex PST Gen II 1-6x this weekend but honestly I think I'm just going to save up for a Leupy.

"We the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful."

PlasticMag posted:
MG in TX posted:
High Exposure posted:

If you are looking at Vortex give them a call or email. They have an excellent Good Guy discount for first responders and .mil (active and ex/retired). I think you are allowed to buy 4 Vortex items a year with your discount.

I have a Strike Eagle 1-6 and I am very impressed with it. It's not a Razor HD model but it's 1/4 the price and IMO it is a lot of scope for the money.

HE any additional feedback w/ that 1-6 Strike Eagle after a few months?

Asking as a Fed TF bud just picked up the 1-8 model SE, seems to like it but haven’t caught up yet w/ him to coon finger it. Like ya said it’s not a Razor HD but given the sale $ he got it for from DSG I’m looking hard @ one when they’re back in stock there.

Not HE, but I've got some thoughts - I had a SE 1-6x for about a year, ended up selling it to a coworker earlier this month (I've got a red dot in the interim while I research LPVOs). The glass was decent but sucked in low light and the full-retard illumination of the reticle turned me off. I wanted a dot, not a light show. That being said, with a throw lever it did the job, held zero fine, survived abuse, etc. For a budget optic it was ok, but again - the glass quality just isn't there.

I'm going to go look at the Vortex PST Gen II 1-6x this weekend but honestly I think I'm just going to save up for a Leupy.

Thx for the feedback PM & all the rest that have weighed in here recently, much appreciated.

Still need to coon finger my buds SE 1-8 as I’ve spent the last sev. years w/ an S&B 1-4 Short Dot, so I’m leaning heavily to making the next buy a 1-8 LPVO at the minimum.

Joined: 3.28.09            

Location: NETX

He covered everything I would say.

It's been robust and held up. Not a fan of the reticle - I've used my buddy's Vortex 1-6 Razor HD and got toess with a Steiner 1-6 much better reticle.

For the money - I think the SE is hard to beat, especially if your not fully sold on the LPVO idea. But once you play with a few higher end models, you start to see what you don't like about it.

That being said - I'm not getting rid of mine. It gives me a decent optic on a training rifle for under $300, freeing up a T1 or PRO for another rifle.

__________________________________
"Experienced cops don't have 'hunches'. They have superior observational and analytical skills which allow them to make the connection between otherwise innocuous facts, and take appropriate action to assess that perception."

~ Doug Mitchell

 

Life is Good!


Joined: 03/08/2008     Location: Sandy Hook, NJ

Crash41984 posted:

Given the offerings they have come out with in the past couple years, some may consider it dated, but for my money, the Trijicon TR24 is really hard to beat. I've got one on my AR deer rifle and never considered replacing it. On 1x, you would have to use a timer to tell if it was faster than a T2. 

Yes, the TR24 is still a viable and solid 1-4x power option.  There are plenty of people that have a favorable opinion of it, and would still rank it up there as one of the best 1-4x LPVO's.

Relevant video on the topic of TR24's versus newer LPVO options:


But if you need more magnification, then stepping up to 1-6x variable power is where its at.  Currently when it comes to 1-6x LPVO's, both the Swarovski Z6i and the Kahles K16i have Trijicon's offerings beat by a country mile  (imho, ymmv)

For anyone looking to get into the LPVO world and save some money Optics Planet currently has a coupon code for the Steiner P4Xi (only the model without the throw lever) that makes it $376.99 shipped. By far the cheapest I've seen it and it has great reviews.  Granted it is only a 1-4 and it seems everyone wants a 1-6 or 1-8 now this is a solid alternative for the price. I ordered one last night and I have no idea how long the sale will be active.

Moustache_6 posted:

Yes, the TR24 is still a viable and solid 1-4x power option.  There are plenty of people that have a favorable opinion of it, and would still rank it up there as one of the best 1-4x LPVO's.

I am planning to get one of these for an AK, as I think anything more than 4x is unnecessary on 7.62x39mm. The question now is, what color reticle? Do  you have experience with red vs green on them?

______________________________________________________

 

"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms." - R. Heinlen

 

Joined:  1/30/05           Location: Graham, Wa

http://www.nightforceoptics.com/nx8/nx8-1-8x24-f1

17 oz. for a durable 1-8x seems pretty wild. Very excited to see real world performance. Hopefully it'll also land on Nightforce's Experticity page, though I'm not hopeful.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

 

老僧三十年前未參禪時、見山是山、見水是水、及至後夾親見知識、有箇入處、見山不是山、見水不是水、而今得箇體歇處、依然見山秪是山、見水秪是水。


Joined: 2008-07-16

$1,750 for the NX & $2,500 for the ATACR is what I found for MSRP.

Curious as to street/LE pricing when this lands. Better yet too bad da GodFather here isn’t a NF dealer, I’d throw down w/ ya on a small LF group buy on 1 of these if he were.

Joined: 3.28.09            

Location: NETX

The ATACR 1-8

http://nightforceoptics.com/atacr/atacr-1-8x24-f1

NX8

http://nightforceoptics.com/nx8/nx8-1-8x24-f1

 

Curious that the ATACR has a slightly narrower field of view than the NX8 with the 30mm tube.  I do like the FC-DM reticle on that ATACR though...might see if they can reticle swap that badboy on the NX8 when I get around to ordering one.

I like nf, but for use on an m4, the bdc of the jm-1 reticle on the vortex 1-6 seems hard to beat yet. The only downside is  nothing to deal with wind. An 8mph bracket on either side would finish it up imo. Using StrelokPro, 20-120* f temperature differences still kept the poi within 10” at 600m for my m855 load data. That’s not bad for a carbine. 

 

Id like to see mil and street price for the atacr. At approx 2x the vortex, it has a hard fight on its hands. That being said, at 8x, it provides more use ability with the mil reticle than the Leopold mk4 that was issued with the m110

dan187 posted:
Moustache_6 posted:

Yes, the TR24 is still a viable and solid 1-4x power option.  There are plenty of people that have a favorable opinion of it, and would still rank it up there as one of the best 1-4x LPVO's.

I am planning to get one of these for an AK, as I think anything more than 4x is unnecessary on 7.62x39mm. The question now is, what color reticle? Do  you have experience with red vs green on them?


I've only used the Amber and Green colors with the Accupoint. 
I can't really say what the best color option for you is, because the "best color" is highly subjective so YMMV.

All I can say is that for me, I find that the glowing green reticle stands out more and appears to be brighter and easier to track than other colors, if it were up to me every RDS and VPO would have the option for a green reticle.

Thanks, I’m most likely going with green. It’s just under $800 on Expercicity.

______________________________________________________

 

"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms." - R. Heinlen

 

Joined:  1/30/05           Location: Graham, Wa

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