AK-47 RFI - Chinese?

I was contacted by a LE buddy who tried to sell some property room guns to Interstate Arms in Taxachusetts, only to discover that the AK he was trying to sell was full auto, so they wouldn't take it. 

 

Anybody have any further info on this thing, or tips on what to do with it? I told him what I thought, that the PD can probably register it in the NFA if they can prove it was pre-1986 and sell it. 

 

It was found by a couple of guys in a river way back when, but has a bayonet and cleaning kit and stuff with it still. The operating components actually look very good. 

 

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Joined:      14 January 2010                Location:  MAINE

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Original Post

I don't know if they can get it registered as a dealer sample, but they won't be able to register it as a transferable.  1986 isn't the magic number for manufacture, it's for registration.  The books don't open for new registration, regardless of when it was manufactured.

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Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

The Type 1 AK-47 was stamped.  I've heard two different reasons why they switched to milled, either of one makes sense.  First, there was limited number of stamping machines available and they needed them for more vital industries.  Switching to milled also provided employment for skilled machinists.  The second stated reason was that the stamped design had flaws.  On the one hand, when they went back to stamped with the introduction of the AKM in 1959, the design was different from the Type 1.  On the other, Type 1's have been found in working condition, still being used, in Iraq and Syria.   What is undisputed however is that the stamped receiver rifles are much more economical to manufacture, use much less metal, and are substantially lighter.

Some may remember a posting in several forums by Doc Cheney regarding Battlefield Vegas's experience with high round counts on their rental machineguns.  They keep meticulous records on rounds fired, parts breakages and when they can no longer put a gun back into use.  The stamped guns would last more than 100,000 rds, but the milled guns were well in excess of that amount.  The milled rifle fanboys were ecstatic, but the reality is a civilian shooter is unlikely to have the money or time to shoot a stamped gun to destruction (in reasonable use).  In military use, the rifle is more likely to be a battlefield casualty before it wears out.

-------------------------

Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

Best you can do if it's not registered is to torch cut the receiver and sell the parts kit. If you do that, keep the front barrel stub and cut behind the trunnion - there are some amazing welding 'smiths who can salvage that and graft it onto a new semi-auto milled receiver to keep as much of the original firearm as possible.

"We the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful."

PlasticMag posted:

Best you can do if it's not registered is to torch cut the receiver and sell the parts kit. If you do that, keep the front barrel stub and cut behind the trunnion - there are some amazing welding 'smiths who can salvage that and graft it onto a new semi-auto milled receiver to keep as much of the original firearm as possible.

Depending on the location of the cuts, there are smiths (like at mygunsnorthwest) that can reweld the original receiver modified to semi only.

______________________________________________________

 

"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms." - R. Heinlen

 

Joined:  1/30/05           Location: Graham, Wa

Dorsai posted:

The Type 1 AK-47 was stamped.  I've heard two different reasons why they switched to milled, either of one makes sense.  First, there was limited number of stamping machines available and they needed them for more vital industries.  Switching to milled also provided employment for skilled machinists.  The second stated reason was that the stamped design had flaws.  On the one hand, when they went back to stamped with the introduction of the AKM in 1959, the design was different from the Type 1.  On the other, Type 1's have been found in working condition, still being used, in Iraq and Syria.   What is undisputed however is that the stamped receiver rifles are much more economical to manufacture, use much less metal, and are substantially lighter.

Some may remember a posting in several forums by Doc Cheney regarding Battlefield Vegas's experience with high round counts on their rental machineguns.  They keep meticulous records on rounds fired, parts breakages and when they can no longer put a gun back into use.  The stamped guns would last more than 100,000 rds, but the milled guns were well in excess of that amount.  The milled rifle fanboys were ecstatic, but the reality is a civilian shooter is unlikely to have the money or time to shoot a stamped gun to destruction (in reasonable use).  In military use, the rifle is more likely to be a battlefield casualty before it wears out.

Three generations of production plant supplied by the USSR?

From the PRC's perspective, they made guns on the factory equipment supplied to them...and kept the previous factory set up producing.

One reason is the sheer demand for weapons in a Nation/State that size: the guy with a Chinese Mauser gets an SKS from a guy who gets a T56 from a guy who gets a stamped T56 etc etc.

They were still looting Mongolian school desks in the late 1980's to make SKS/SKK .

Another reason to keep the factories open is training of apprentices, engineers etc.  Eugene Stoner once toured the PRC small arms establishment & was impressed with the sheer size of it...and the numbers of students studying the craft at all levels. 

Dorsai posted:

I don't know if they can get it registered as a dealer sample, but they won't be able to register it as a transferable.  1986 isn't the magic number for manufacture, it's for registration.  The books don't open for new registration, regardless of when it was manufactured.

That law just needs to die. And the pre-68 for foreign-manufacture. An MP5SD *really* needs to find its way into my safe. And a couple Knights beltfeds (damn it Ash!)

Joined: 30 May 2003                  Location: SE PA

Maybe there is a way to donate it to a museum ? Would be terrible to see it cut up. 

______________________________________________________

 

"Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor, and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and freedoms." - R. Heinlen

 

Joined:  1/30/05           Location: Graham, Wa

Thanks for all the replies, I was unaware that even LE couldn't have a pre-1986 made weapon added to the NFA registry. I know the PD in question has been talking with the ATF and doing e-trace on it, but they are apparently unaware also.  They aren't going to destroy it, if it can't be legally sold for some extra training $$$ then they are just going to keep it as a range toy/curiosity/familiarization tool.  Not like it takes up a bunch of space!

 

I'll report back if any interesting story details come out of the e-trace. Not surprised this place didn't fully flesh it out (or even know it was full auto) at the time it was recovered... I always toss my full auto AK's in a river. ALWAYS. 

 

 

 

 

Joined:      14 January 2010                Location:  MAINE

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