Is there any quality defensive round out there that will provide decent performance out of an 8.5” barrel?  For whatever reason, the LWRC PDW has caught my eye.  I already have a .300 SBR with LAW folder that fits in a backpack, but the cool-guy factor of the LWRC has me intrigued.  If there’s no good ammunition option out there for that short a barrel in 5.56mm, I will probably save my money and be satisfied with what I already have.  But, if there is something out there offering adequate performance...

Joined: 2JAN2004

Location: South Florida

Original Post

Inquiring minds would also like to know 

I am a Deacon from the Church of the Painful Truth 

...it's not the arrow, it's the Indian 

"In times of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act." -George Orwell

.45ACP, because sometimes short, fat and slow will do the job.

"Stand your ground. Don't fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war let it begin here." Captain John Parker, to his Minute Men on Lexington Green, April 19, 1775.

I’m definitely interested as well.  

Mojo/Mark
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Yo homey, is that my briefcase...?
Vincent from "Collateral"
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You want the good life, you break your back, you snap your fingers, you snap your neck... Prong/Demon Hunter
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That's one... 


Joined: 9/30/09
Location: Northern Nevada (Reno/Sparks)

Check some of the prior posts on 5.56mm, particularly LEO.  A good soft point, probably bonded.  The expensive stuff.  FMJ that depends on velocity to cause fragmentation is unlikely to work.  I'm guessing you've got less than 2,500fps at the muzzle.  If you do meet that threshold, it's barely.  And 2,500fps is an average.  Anything that reduces your velocity won't work well.  You want bullets that expand, not fragment.  The good stuff.

-------------------------

Mark

Swear allegiance to the flag Whatever flag they offer

Never hint at what you really feel

Teach the children quietly For some day sons and daughters

Will rise up and fight while we stood still

 

Joined:  2/24/2003                          Location:  Nevada, USA

Dorsai posted:

Check some of the prior posts on 5.56mm, particularly LEO.  A good soft point, probably bonded.  The expensive stuff.  FMJ that depends on velocity to cause fragmentation is unlikely to work.  I'm guessing you've got less than 2,500fps at the muzzle.  If you do meet that threshold, it's barely.  And 2,500fps is an average.  Anything that reduces your velocity won't work well.  You want bullets that expand, not fragment.  The good stuff.

Yeah, everything I dug up within the past couple years was for 10.5 and above.  Nothing shorter.

Joined: 2JAN2004

Location: South Florida

I have done no testing, but have done some research into this and have come up with zero loads manufactured for ultra short 5.56 barrels (less than 10.5").   The introduction of the LVAW in 5.56 for the SAS made me wonder if Sig or similar would develop a load for that platform to perform out of the 5.5" barrel, but I haven't seen one.  Sig producing the rattler platform commercially in .300 instead of the originally requested 5.56 seems to indicate that either the end users or the engineers or both realized that the .300 took much better to such a short length than the 5.56 but that is all supposition on my part. 

Sig does produce a specific rattler load in the .300 to maximize potential out of the 5.5" tube.  

 

The expansion floor for Gold Dot that is often bandied about is 1600 FPS (generally the 55 gr. and 62/64 gr., not so much chatter on the 75 gr.); not sure how true that actually is, though. I have been told that when ICE specced out their duty ammo (which was selected to be 64 gr. Gold Dot, IIRC), they required expansion at least below 1800 FPS.

Hornady TAP SBR has been stated to have an expansion velocity of 1500-1600 FPS (according to Kathy McHale, LE sales rep at Hornady circa 2016-MAR).

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

 

老僧三十年前未參禪時、見山是山、見水是水、及至後夾親見知識、有箇入處、見山不是山、見水不是水、而今得箇體歇處、依然見山秪是山、見水秪是水。


Joined: 2008-07-16

64gr Gold Dot out of an 8" barrel is still opening up and penetrating at 100 yards through the standard battery of intermediate barriers and in bare gel.  I suspect the Federal TBBC would do the same albeit at a higher price tag. 

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