Hi all,

i tried a search and got nothing . 

Maybe I'm in th 10% that never gets the word (pretty common for me) but I just saw ads for this ammo. I've got a fair amount of 147gr duty ammo, old CorBon, Gold Dot and HST.  

Speer is hyping this as the next great thing with:

"Gold Dot G2 next-generation duty bullet design. Instead of a large cavity in the nose, this round has only a shallow dish filled with a high-performance elastomer. On impact, the elastomer is forced into engineered internal fissures to start the expansion process, as opposed to conventional bullet designs, which rely on target media to enter the hollow-point and create expansion forces. The result is extremely uniform expansion, better separation of the petals, and more consistent penetration across barrier types, gun platforms and barrel lengths." 

Anyone have real world experience, test or duty that makes this a good choice for the next order?  Target Sport has it for $0.60 a round, Bone Frog for $0.55 (both in 1K case buys), not sure what a good deal is, if it is a good round.  

Thanks in advance 

 

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“Speak softly and carry a big stick;  you will go far. “

 Theodore Roosevelt

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Joined: 29 May 2008          Location: AZ

Original Post
Hush posted:

This is the new hotness, developed for the new FBI specs.

I've heard both statements that contract allotment overrun was the reason for the order for the Hornady Critical Duty 135 gr +P, and that the round was underperforming. Not sure which is true, but for now, I'm not switching over the the G2 until it becomes more clear, and a good practice round that can approximate its external ballistics nicely is found. That being said, it is on DocGKR's list, had its own set of tests by DocGKR to compare it against other 147 gr, and Federal has supposedly cleared up the teething issues the round was originally having with the 4LD tests.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

 

老僧三十年前未參禪時、見山是山、見水是水、及至後夾親見知識、有箇入處、見山不是山、見水不是水、而今得箇體歇處、依然見山秪是山、見水秪是水。


Joined: 2008-07-16

Don’t recall if DocGKR has tested this. I’ll stick with my 147 HST until compelling evidence convinces me to change. 

Mojo/Mark
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Joined: 9/30/09
Location: Northern Nevada (Reno/Sparks)

Gotcha, being on Doc R's list settles the issue. 

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“Speak softly and carry a big stick;  you will go far. “

 Theodore Roosevelt

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Joined: 29 May 2008          Location: AZ

Well OK, there are about 33 pages on pistol forum on the product since 2014, some with Doc Roberts input. I apologize for not checking there first, or reading all the pages  

https://pistol-forum.com/showt...-G2-147-grain-PT-9mm

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“Speak softly and carry a big stick;  you will go far. “

 Theodore Roosevelt

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Joined: 29 May 2008          Location: AZ

B0308 posted:

Gotcha, being on Doc R's list settles the issue. 

There's a The List? Like, a publicly visible one? Where is this? 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

shoobe01 posted:
B0308 posted:

Gotcha, being on Doc R's list settles the issue. 

There's a The List? Like, a publicly visible one? Where is this? 

On the off-chance you're serious, there are older versions right in this sub-forum:

https://www.lightfighter.net/t...nd-self-defense-ammo

https://www.lightfighter.net/topic/5-56-mm-duty-loads

The PF ones are a bit more up-to-date:

https://pistol-forum.com/showt...nd-Self-Defense-Ammo

https://pistol-forum.com/showt...4-5-56-mm-Duty-Loads

Here is the 147 gr specific testing I was alluding to: https://pistol-forum.com/showt...gr-duty-load-testing

DocGKR really should update the links to the images, though.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

 

老僧三十年前未參禪時、見山是山、見水是水、及至後夾親見知識、有箇入處、見山不是山、見水不是水、而今得箇體歇處、依然見山秪是山、見水秪是水。


Joined: 2008-07-16

Yeah, like the OP here I am used to searching lf.net and if no-joy I just don't know. I was hoping he had his own site or something and a The List®. 

Not a pistol-forum follower, so missed those. 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

Thanks to Doc R and all responding. 

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“Speak softly and carry a big stick;  you will go far. “

 Theodore Roosevelt

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Joined: 29 May 2008          Location: AZ

Just FYI, I picked up a 50-round box of G2 at a local shop in El Paso last year for around $25 (seemed cheap). When I got home, I noticed that the other end of the box had a disclaimed sticker in it saying that it was not for duty use. Next time I was at the shop, the guy said that Speer had a shelf collapse in the warehouse, and they put that disclaimer on all the ammo that was stored on it. Just thought I’d mention that in case anyone comes across some G2 from that batch.

Dave

So it's sold because we're all fools, or because still good for "practice with your duty ammo" as profile, pressure, etc. is usually similar so you can get feed and recoil accurately? 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

Thanks for all the inputs. 

For a change checking on LF "saved" me $$ 

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“Speak softly and carry a big stick;  you will go far. “

 Theodore Roosevelt

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Joined: 29 May 2008          Location: AZ

Based on the FBI test results that I saw regarding the 9mm GD 147 G2, we will be transitioning to it in 2019, from the regular 9mm GD 147.

Mind you, the regular GE 147 is no slouch, and performed as advertised in a OIS that we had.

The differences in the premium JHPs, like product for like product, are fairly small.  Get a quality cartridge that you know is reliable, and then concern yourself with things like skill, decision making, tactics, etc.  

 

The GD2 penetrates a bit deeper (15-18"), but expands a bit less--this is an advantage if you work around vehicles.  If your are more likely to have less obstructed engagements, then the standard GD which penetrates a bit less (13-15") and expands a bit more is probably the better choice...

Allow me to necromance this thread:

Has anything changed since, well, this time last year? My PD is in the process of switching to this round (9mm 147gr G2) from our old 40-cal round (180gr HST). My responses when I was informed of these changes were as follows:

Them: "Hey, we're switching to 9"
Me: "Outstanding!"
Them: "We're going with a 147gr load."
Me: " ... okaaaaaaaaaaaay..."
Them: "Yeah, the Speer Gold Dot G2."
Me: " ... "
Them: "What?"
Me: "... I just figured that we would go with the 124gr Gold Dot, since we already stock that for off-duty guns."
Them: "Nope."

I dunno. We work in and around cars and other barriers (urban LE), so I guess it's not a bad choice. I just scratched my head a bit. I take it this is still on Doc's G2G list?

Mike

PS- how does it shoot, recoil-wise, compared to the 124gr load? I have a sneaking suspicion that they want the lightest recoiling thing they can find in 9mm, so as to minimize training issues. The weapon in question is the M&P 2.0 in 9mm (full size).

Not stressed, but I am a carrier.

I think 147s, and specifically the couple times I have accidentally bought a box of 147 GDs — then shot 'em up — are noticeably more recoily. About like shooting a heavy .40 at least in small things like my Kahr. I strongly prefer 124s for control, speed, etc. if I am gonna have a 9. Which I do, on purpose.  

Is your agency planning to carry both rounds now, or replace the 124s for off duty stuff? 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

Unknown. My guess is that once they get the transition done, they will continue to issue the 124 for off-duty/backup until on-hand supplies are gone, and then consolidate on the 147gr for everything. Depending on how many rounds they have, it could take a while.

I'll have to shoot them side by side and see which is lower recoil. My perception of the 124 is that it is snappier than 115gr practice ammo, but by no means bad. Also, running 124gr through a 16" carbine (my own toy, nothing to do with work stuff) I find that it actually HAS recoil (just not much), as opposed to 115gr through the same gun, which is like shooting a .22 ...

Not stressed, but I am a carrier.

Agree with 115 vs 124. Enough to take it seriously, but not annoying in any platform. If anything, in a carbine 124s are more fun than 115s. And really, a PCC is just for fun

The difference is why I have no 115 in the house. Practice with cheap ball 124s. Got a deal on a case of Geco (RUAG) 124 the other day even so sometimes it's real fun euro-sourced 8g ammo, which makes me happy somehow. 

The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life. – Theodore Roosevelt

 

Joined: 19NOV2004   Location: Mission, Kansas

Good deal. Thanks.

Am I correct in saying that the general consensus was that it tended to not expand quite as consistently as other offerings after going through heavy clothing? I watched the Sage Dynamics video and, while he was pleased with the round's performance through auto glass, he was not happy with its performance through heavy clothing (IIRC, he followed the FBI protocol as closely as he could).

 

Not stressed, but I am a carrier.

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